Don't Eat Poop! A Food Safety Podcast

DEP E157
[00:00:00] Tia: Then randomly he brings up, Hey, lemme ask you this question. We have to change out gaskets. Like we have this program, we have to change out gaskets. And when I go in and change them, they're perfectly fine. Like, why do I need to go in and change these gaskets every three months, every six months when they're perfectly fine?
And so what I told him is that we're not running to failure. 'cause if we run to failure, gaskets are gonna tear up and they're gonna end up in the product and then your grandkids are gonna find it. And that's not what we want. A light bulb literally went off in his head and he was like, oh, that makes sense.
Yes. We don't want to find that in the product. And I know people have told him this, right? Like I know people have said, you know, parts can get in our product, people can choke on it, people can die from it. Like all of those things have happened. But no one had actually told him how this thing. Directly impacts what he cares about.[00:01:00]
[00:01:01] Intro: Everybody's gotta eat and nobody likes getting sick. That's why heroes toil in the shadows, keeping your food safe at all points from the supply chain to the point of sale. Join industry veterans, Francine l Shaw and Matt Ucci for a deep dive into food safety. It all boils down to one golden rule. Don't.
Eat poop. Don't eat poop.
[00:01:26] Matt: Hello? Hello?
[00:01:28] Tia: Hi.
[00:01:29] Matt: So we are at the Food Safety Consortium and of course it's such a pleasure to be here with Tia. 'cause Tia is like one of our favorite people. Friend Tina and I absolutely love you. So we're at the Food Safety Consortium. We're talking with Tia, and we've had multiple conversations with you in the past.
So we'll link in the description, our past conversations with you.
[00:01:52] Francine: Awesome.
[00:01:52] Matt: Yes, Tia, tell us about yourself and what you do.
[00:01:57] Tia: Yes. So for those who do not know me, my name is [00:02:00] Tia Gla and I am co-founder of Catalyst, catalyst Food Leaders. What I do today, so I've been in the food industry for about 13 years, supporting large manufacturing, small manufacturing, food service startup.
Basically all types of products within the food industry, either working directly with the organization or consulting. And I've taken that knowledge with my co-founder, Jill Stuber, and created Catalyst where we focus today on developing leaders within the food space. One thing that we saw in our careers is that we were really strong, technically, right?
People around us are really strong. Technically we know our stuff, but it was really hard for people to influence, for people, to build relationships, for people, really, to have those soft skills, leadership skills, and the organization, and that stopped progress. So our goal is really to help reimagine how you lead in food.
That's all of Catalyst's mission is how do we transform how leaders lead in food so that they're authentically [00:03:00] themselves so that they can empower themselves in each other and ultimately deliver results.
[00:03:06] Francine: So Matt and I for a couple years now have been talking a lot about the culture of food safety, and that is so important and.
To culture has become a huge buzz buzzword and unfortunately that's a lot. It's not intentional. I believe that people just don't know where to start and it's complicated, you know? It is very complicated. It takes more than just food safety to create the culture. Yes, those soft skills that you're talking about.
Are a significant part of food safety culture. If you do not have those soft skills, you're not gonna be able to get the buy-in. You are not gonna be able to communicate what you want to do, need to do. And the executives, [00:04:00] which are a large part of what you're talking to the employees too, right?
[00:04:03] Tia: Yes,
[00:04:04] Francine: yes, yes.
That. You are not gonna be able to do what you need to do. Right. To create that culture.
[00:04:09] Tia: Exactly. The goal is behavior change, right? You want people to change what they're doing, change their behavior, and many times when we talk to people about food safety culture, they're really only talking about food safety, not the culture piece.
And. It's typically processes that we need to do audits, we need to pass gaps in our programs. Or they're really not just doing the checks and it's so focused on food safety, which needs to be there. Right? That's a hundred percent culture. But in reality, many of us have food safety figured out. We know the processes that we need.
Even if we are not doing them, we know that what we need to do. The problem is we don't have the human behavior piece, the culture piece. And so we focus on the culture. When people come to us, oh, we need help with food safety culture, we typically say, well, what are you working on? And it has zero to do with people, zero to do with [00:05:00] soft skills, zero to do with building those leadership skills, and we help them really think through what food safety culture is and why they need to be focused on culture.
Human behaviors, norms, conversations, building relationships, all of those pieces, that's a part of really the umbrella of culture.
[00:05:17] Francine: You guys understand 100%, without a doubt. You don't do this in one day. Oh yeah. Or two days in so many programs. Are created that are, you go in and you take an eight hour class, or you go in and you take a 16 hour class, or you go in and you take a, even a one week class.
Mm-hmm. And you can't change behavior. In eight hours or 16 hours, or even three days or five days, it takes time. Behaviors are learned and they're taught and they happen over an extended period of time. And it takes time to [00:06:00] relearn those behaviors and to teach those behaviors. And you know, Matt and I've been working on a program yes.
As well. That's what's missing. Yeah. In the industry is these program and programs like you have that will teach people how to change these behaviors. Yes. Not just tell them how to do it, but to teach them and to educate and to work with them to change these behaviors and to help them learn how to start and where to start.
[00:06:31] Tia: Yes,
[00:06:31] Francine: and kudos to you guys for doing that because you've been working on it for a while and it's amazing. I love, we love
[00:06:37] Tia: what you
[00:06:37] Francine: do
[00:06:38] Tia: well. We love what you all do because you're right. Like it's not a one day thing. It's not a weak thing. And many times it's not even a year thing. If you've been having a poor culture for years and years and years.
It's not gonna change over a year. I did this research around just change management a couple of years ago, and it really came from this question of how long does it actually take for human [00:07:00] behavior to change? And many people think that it's 21 days, right? There's a popular 21 habit book that's out there.
There's actually many habit books that's out there. That's like seven days, 21 days, 90 days when in reality. Research shows that it takes on average almost a year, like 256 or something like that, days to actually change one behavior that you're actively, intentionally focused on. Almost a year to change.
So even that mindset shift of, okay, this is going to take us a while to change, but where do we wanna focus first? Culture, there's a lot of things in culture that you can focus on. What do you need in your organization and how do you really put a great plan in place to tackle that? That problem for the next year, for the next three years, sometimes depending on your organization.
And that's exactly what we do. We use leadership development concepts. We use behavior science, and both Jill and I were certified coaches, so we also use the science of coaching to be able to [00:08:00] help people change their behaviors over time. Right, and that it sticks right and that it becomes who you are as a leader.
Because with coaching, it really draws out yourself and how you want to present yourself to the world. And it doesn't matter what type of personality you are, if you're introvert, extroverted, if you're loud, not loud, if you're charismatic or like to sit in the back, whatever it is, you are a leader and you can bring out those qualities.
Of yourself as a leader in spaces. You just have to learn how to do that. And many of us do not have any education around that. We, like you said, Francine, you sit in a one day course or you might take a virtual course and read about how to influence or, yes, I need to build relationships, but how do I actually do that?
That is a skill.
[00:08:47] Matt: That's why I love your guys' program so much, and I didn't even think about it until just now. That was my degree is my degree is in business management with an emphasis in change management. So I took a whole lot of courses in [00:09:00] college about psychology of organizations. So the macro view of psychology, and when I told the story a lot of the podcast, but when I got outta college and I got hired by Primus Labs, I asked 'em, I was like, why are you hiring me?
Like I don't have a food science degree and da da da. And they're like, we have plenty of people with food science chemists and. Biology degrees. We're trying to train the produce industry, the farming industry, that they need to do food safety and that actually needs change management. Yes. And so I never, I, when I got into there, it was like day one that I realized, oh yeah, this is exactly change management.
We need to start with the organization at a base level and then grow in food safety as it goes. And I was talking the other day that. There are a few different types of like food safety people. The base level is like the checklist people. Mm-hmm. And when I first started, a lot of people were that, that started doing food safety, were like the executive assistants or like the, and this was like 20 years ago, like [00:10:00] over 20 years ago.
This people who knew how to do paperwork, they didn't really have food safety people back then. And, and it was like, Hey, this is a paperwork problem. Go figure out what we need to do and then start trying to implement this stuff within the organization. The one above that is like risk assessment people.
Oh yeah. Right. Okay. Okay. So here's the paperwork. This is like a checklist. I can do the checklist, but now it's like, what are my risks? Mm-hmm. And how do I assess them? The next level up is, okay, now that I know these risks, what is the enemy? The enemy is pathogens, so I'm gonna go seek and destroy these pathogens.
Mm-hmm. I'm really gonna go find them. And then the fourth level is somebody who can explain the why.
[00:10:39] Francine: Yeah.
[00:10:39] Matt: Because as you go up that chain, it's very. Task oriented. Mm-hmm. Right? Mm-hmm. The level of degree of food safety knowledge grows. Mm-hmm. You don't have to have a like full degree in order to figure out those three levels and you don't have to have a full degree to under to do the fourth level.
You don't have to have microbiology degree to figure out what the enemy is within my [00:11:00] facility. Right. And how to seek and destroy it. There's plenty of people you can use to help you. But that last part is the change management part, that fourth part, because as you start growing in the food safety and you start figuring out your risks and then figuring out how to seek and destroy that enemy, the listeria or salmonella or e coli or whatever, bacteria or contaminant in general, chemicals, et cetera, et cetera.
Then all of a sudden you're spending money. And when you're spending money now all of a sudden the CFO, the CEO, the COO, or you're stopping a line because you found something, and now the COO was like, why are you stopping my line? Right? If you can't articulate that, that because I'm trying to destroy this enemy, then your program's gonna get cut.
[00:11:44] Tia: Yeah, absolutely. Absolutely. And when you say, explain the why, I wanna take it a step forward. Explain their why to them and connect it to what you're doing because you know when, exactly what you're saying, if you, [00:12:00] now it's time to spend money, right? We know what the risk is. We understand what we're going after, and now it's time to spend money.
And now everyone takes a step back, right? Because now it's time to spend money. Why do they care about listeria in a drain? That person. Right? Not that function. Like a lot of people, I was just talking about this last night actually, around inspirational leadership and connecting to people's values and what they believe and what's important to them.
A lot of people think finance, they only care about money, so that's what I'm gonna give to them. I've had a finance person that cared about food safety deeply. So if I came to them and said, Hey, we have listeria in this drain, and the reason why we care about it is because as people walk over the drain, it can then get into our production and then possibly move into our zone two and zone ones.
That made to him. So he was ready to spend money. I worked with people. The bottom line, how much it's gonna cost, what is the true risk around it? Do other people feel like it's a risk? What are other organizations doing? Okay, well that's what they value, so I need to come with that information for them.
Some people, right? I [00:13:00] was telling a story around like even maintenance. This is my favorite story around connecting to people's whys with a maintenance tech on a line and people I had just started and people said about this maintenance tech that. He did not care. He didn't care about his job. He didn't care about the product that we made.
He didn't care about what we do. He doesn't, he definitely doesn't care about food safety. He just complains. So for me, I'm like, I wanna meet this guy. Right? Like typically,
[00:13:26] Francine: challenge accepted,
[00:13:27] Tia: challenge accepted. And typically if there's a squeaky wheel, they're squeaking about something. So I wanna know like, what is it?
And so I just spent time with him on the line. We're walking the line. I was having him explain the line from a maintenance perspective. And so we're talking, I'm really building that relationship, right? And I'm listening for what he values and what he actually cares about. And he eventually goes into why he cares so much is because his grandkids eat this product.
And I'm like, Ooh. Got it. Right Now I know why this is so important, and when whatever he's [00:14:00] squeaking about, he thinks it impacts the product in that way and he cares about it because of his grandkids. Then randomly he brings up, Hey, lemme ask you this question. We have to change out gaskets. Like we have this program, we have to change out gaskets, and when I go in and change them, they're perfectly fine.
Like, why do I need to go in and change these gaskets every three months, every six months when they're perfectly fine? So what I told him is that we're not running to failure because if we run to failure, gaskets are gonna tear up and they're gonna end up in the product and then your grandkids are gonna find it.
And that's not what we want. A light bulb literally went off in his head and he was like, oh, that makes sense. Yes. We don't want to find that in the product. And I know people have told him this, right? Like, I know people have said parts can get in our product, people can choke on it, people can die from it.
Like all of those things have happened, but no one had actually told him how this thing. Directly impacts what he cares about. [00:15:00] And that's what leaders have to do. Like we have a lot of stories. We can bring out complaints, we can bring out recalls, we can bring out all of this stuff. But if it doesn't connect with your audience, it doesn't matter.
No matter how important you feel like it is, no matter how impactful it is to the world to you, none of that actually matters if that person cannot connect to it. Some people have never had kids, they don't wanna be around kids. So you telling a story about kids being impacted. They don't care, right? Sure.
We want kids. We want them to grow up. Obviously, they're a part of society, but for some people, right? They just don't have that deep connection to kids. That should not be the story that you share. That's not how you should connect with that person. But you won't know until you build relationships, until they feel safe enough to tell you what their values are, what they believe.
But once you have it, then lean into that and connect it for, for them. I used his grandkids for a lot of examples on what I needed maintenance to do because I was able to connect it to his values, and that's what we're missing. That's the culture [00:16:00] piece, right?
[00:16:01] Matt: You're absolutely correct. So the reason why I've at Ellipse Analytics today and.
That's part of Clean Label Project where the certification and testing arm of Clean label project is. The former executive director, Jackie Bowen, wanted me to run, ellipse, wanted me to run her certification and testing arm, and I was in a perfectly good position. I was loving what I was doing, helping the industry, consulting the industry on traceability and FISMA two A four.
Like there was no reason for me to leave what I was doing to this, but she's like, oh, just, just come to breakfast with me. So we go to breakfast and she's like, Matt. This lab tests baby food and you love babies. How many babies have you had? And I was like, oh, geez, I know where this is going. I was like, I don't know, probably over 20 babies, right?
Because I love babies and she's like. We're testing the formula, we're testing the baby food, we're testing the supplements, we're testing everything that's going in for babies. And this brings both things that you absolutely love together, [00:17:00] babies and food safety, and you're passionate about both. And you could bring them both together.
And I'm like, okay. I remember sitting down with Andy. Andy is like, who is my partner at New Air Partners for Clean label project? He was like. So why are you gonna leave? And I told him, he was like, okay, I totally understand. I get it. I know you, I get why I'm talking to the CEO of I food ds, which owned new era partners.
And he was like, okay, I get it. I understand why you left. This is why you're leaving. This really sucks for us. But this, I understand why you're leaving, but she's genius. Putting that connection together. And she knew, okay, if I sit down in front of him and I explain to him, he's going to move. So that works for everybody.
It doesn't matter what position they're in. And so, absolutely, 100% great
[00:17:47] Tia: analogy, and you can learn to do that. You can learn to identify those things through conversations. You can learn how to have those type of conversations to figure out values. Now, some people, I'm gonna admit, some people, they get it right?
Like they can do [00:18:00] it. They can build relationships. I'm one of those people. So I've been practicing since I was a kid, right? Because that's how I built relationships. Some people haven't practiced that, right? Like they did not have these type of conversations as kids. It doesn't mean you can't. You can learn those skills to be able to do that, and now you're hooked and you're not just hooked in a way that's like, okay, she brought me in the organization she thinks is a good fit.
Let me just see. You're like, no, like I'm now a part of this mission. So now you talk about the same things that she told you about in other rooms that she's not even there. That's what we want. When we think about food safety culture, like I don't need to be the voice of food safety culture as a food safety professional.
Everyone knows I care about it. I need that maintenance tech to be talking about it, right? I need the finance team to be talking about it in a meeting. I need someone else that I didn't even know heard me to be talking about it in their circles. That's what we need. We need that commitment and you get it through connecting through their values.
And everyone, I'm telling you, everyone can do this. You just need to gain that skill and practice till you do it in a way [00:19:00] that works for you.
[00:19:01] Matt: Do you help people write budgets? So one of the things that I found was. When I was like helping people with food safety and getting food safety programs into their facilities, in their farms, stuff like that was the food safety people were hung up, some of them.
Mm-hmm. Not everybody, but some of them were really hung up on like the budget.
[00:19:20] Tia: Yeah.
[00:19:21] Matt: Like it had everybody aligned, like, okay, we totally get it. We get the mission. Okay, what's the budget? Mm-hmm. And then they would go and they would go like, okay, this is all the things that I would need. And they create this budget that's absolutely massive.
Right, right. And then it gets knocked down. Okay, this may be your budget, but we don't have room in our budget to fit this whole entire thing. I would help like, okay. What is the priority for this year? And then tack it on and help them create like a three year budget.
[00:19:48] Tia: Yes.
[00:19:48] Matt: Where they can the CFO, the CEO, and everybody can see incrementally the into where they want to go.
But here's the risks that need to be figured out. Like right now, yes. Like everything in [00:20:00] zone one, everything with suppliers, everything like that is, is the biggest risk. Or like on the farm, the water, the fertilizer, like these are all the things that we need to make sure everything is fine there. And then incrementally go and it like it was something that I just did it.
It's something I do naturally. So I would just help them create that. But do you help people like create those budgets and figure out like what, because food safety, people like finance might not be their thing, right? Yeah. They could be a food safety person and have amazing soft skills and then all of a sudden get hung up on the budget.
[00:20:30] Tia: Yeah, we do. We do. And we put this in a bucket of helping people with their strategy. Around culture strategy, talent strategy, food safety, culture strategy. When you're thinking about your budget, and one thing that sets us apart from other leadership development people that's out there is that we are industry specific, right?
Like Jill and I, we both have created budgets for organizations. We both have been shut down, right? And said, Nope, we don't have this in the budget. We both have developed these multi-year plans on how do we actually look at the risk this [00:21:00] year? What are we trying to do in five years and how do we close those gaps over the years based on the money that we know that we're gonna have?
We also have a lot of conversations around, okay, if it's not in the food safety budget, does it live somewhere else? So how do you also have those conversations? So yes, we definitely do that type of work.
[00:21:15] Francine: You both just brought up a really good point that I, you know, I guess I've thought about before, but don't think about a lot because we all have this skillset.
We've all seen a profit and loss statement. We know what a p and l looks like, and we understand and can read a p and l, but there's a lot of people that do what we do that. I haven't seen a profit in last statement.
[00:21:36] Matt: Oh, you don't even know how many times I've actually heard. What's a p and l?
[00:21:41] Tia: Yeah.
[00:21:41] Matt: Like I'll say like, oh, where are you on the p and l?
And they're like, what's a p and l? And I'm like, okay. So I guess nowhere.
[00:21:49] Tia: But this is why the food safety industry needs people like us, is because we really are siloed and they don't give us the type of development that we actually need in food safety.
[00:21:59] Francine: Well, [00:22:00] so much so Matt did. I stopped saying p and l.
I say profit and loss.
[00:22:04] Tia: Oh yeah. Because
[00:22:04] Francine: they don't, I stopped saying p and l because people don't know what the term p and l means. Yeah. P and l was my vocab for years. You know, I just said p and l because everybody in the, but I talked to you knew what a p and L was, right? Yeah. But I just started saying profit and loss.
'cause people didn't,
[00:22:17] Matt: yeah,
[00:22:17] Tia: they didn't know
[00:22:18] Francine: the other thing. What was the other thing that I was gonna say? They'll come back. Yeah.
[00:22:23] Matt: Yeah. Like that type of stuff is. We say it's simple because it really, once you learn that skill, it's pretty simple. It's just, you just put your stuff in an Excel spreadsheet once you built it, and then it just, you just keep popping it up.
[00:22:35] Francine: I remember the other thing is there was a time when industry didn't really care for consultants that had this vast knowledge because it was like, yeah. How can they really have knowledge in all of these areas? Yeah. Yeah. How is that possible? It just, they just can't possibly, because we've worked with all of these [00:23:00] people in all these different areas to develop these skillsets.
Right. And to learn them. And to learn them well. Mm-hmm. And we've worked with these various companies. And taking the training classes and worked hard to learn these things.
[00:23:14] Tia: Yeah.
[00:23:15] Francine: That's starting to change.
[00:23:17] Tia: That is starting to change
[00:23:18] Francine: to It is
[00:23:18] Tia: need to
[00:23:18] Francine: change.
[00:23:19] Tia: It needs to. You're absolutely right. I mean, most of us have worked cross-functionally.
I've literally led a maintenance and facilities team for organization. Now. I don't know why this happened. How did this fall into my lap? But it did. Right? So I learned even more about maintenance. I know you've ran a restaurant. Those skills. Right. A lot of people don't get them. They're just siloed. But I'm glad that it's shifting because we do have this knowledge and we can easily apply it across the industry.
[00:23:47] Francine: Right? And sometimes it's difficult. My daughter and I talk about this a lot because it's, sometimes it's difficult when people say, well, what can you do in your responses every, what do you exactly. What industry are you in and [00:24:00] what do you need? Yeah. Because there's really nothing at this point that I've not done or helped somebody do.
And they struggle with that. Yeah. Because they don't believe you. I'm really good at what I do. I can really do anything.
[00:24:15] Matt: Well, and it the really, you're more importantly, we're one degree from everybody who's an expert, right? So when you bring somebody who's helping you with all these different types of.
Every part of the organization with food safety, they're not going to be an expert at every part of the food safety. Right. But they're gonna be able to help you put together a plan and then. In something like what you do, Tia, is you're building a network, right? Because even amongst the different companies you work with, there are experts at different things within that.
When you hire a food safety person, that food safety person is not gonna be an expert in every single thing, right?
[00:24:51] Tia: Yeah.
[00:24:52] Matt: But once they build the network, they're a phone call away from anybody who is an expert. Yes. And that's what becomes very valuable is, oh, [00:25:00] you know what? That's a really good question. I don't know how to do that, but I definitely know someone who does.
Mm-hmm. And I can give them a call and we can figure this out.
[00:25:07] Francine: Right. I was being sarcastic. But you can pick up the phone and have an answer in a matter of minutes. Yes. Or you can find somebody to help them because you literally have those networks.
[00:25:17] Tia: Right. Exactly. Exactly. And like you said, it's valuable.
Right? It's valuable. And we're working with a client, so catalyst. The majority of our business is leadership, development, culture work, but we do food safety, quality regulatory consulting. And we have this client who we're helping and she was talking to someone else and talking to us at the time that we were like work, you know, bidding and.
Thinking about who they wanna work with. And the other person was saying that, yeah, you'll have a regulatory person, you'll have this person, you'll have that person. And was almost giving them like three resources and it was almost overwhelming to them. And so with me, they were like, is it just gonna be one person or are you gonna put like other people?
And I'm like, no, you'll have one person. And if that person [00:26:00] needs to reach out and get some expertise somewhere else because something came up, then that's what we will do. We have a network supporting. That person versus like you having, all of a sudden now you have three people on your food safety team when really you're looking for that one direction.
So I think what Francine, what you're saying, where it's changing, where organizations really just need one person to help them manage what's happening. Then you reach out to people if you need some extra training or you need to learn something more about a regulation because you haven't dove deep into it, or you need to reach out to the produce person that you have because it's something that's really in depth in the produce industry.
Then. That's something that we can do. And strong networks. That's why strong networks so important.
[00:26:44] Francine: Right,
[00:26:45] Tia: right. Strong networks. You can do that and you can pick, like you said, pick up the phone and find an answer like that. Right? Or you can bring on that person and say, Hey, for the special project, I really need your expertise here.
I've done that. I've, we worked on the international project and I don't know the [00:27:00] regulations in Africa, right? In different countries in Africa. Right. They're all different. They all have different. Just almost like the states here, right? Like they're, they're different, but I know someone who might, I know someone that I can connect them with and learn about labeling in different parts of Africa where they're trying to sell.
So it's that where we lean on all the time in our network. On the consulting side, but also on the coaching side and leadership development, we are actively looking for coaches to help with leadership development and to help have these conversations with people because we know that. Our goal is to create this movement around how we lead in food differently.
And it just can't be Jill and myself doing that. Like we really do need people that are committed to how do we, how do we shift the way that we lead,
[00:27:47] Francine: right? And that's how we change the culture. That's how we change the culture. Yeah. And
[00:27:51] Matt: on that note, call Jill. Call Tia. Yeah. To change your culture. So before we go, I'd like to ask everybody, Francine, [00:28:00] and I like to ask everybody at Food Safety Consortium, what's your favorite thing about Food Safety Consortium?
[00:28:03] Tia: Hmm. My favorite thing about this conference is that I really feel like I could have deep conversations with people.
[00:28:09] Matt: Yeah.
[00:28:09] Tia: I feel like that we can get into these conversations about what's going on. This conference is very regulatory focused in the sense of what's happening in government, what's happening around regulations and policies.
Very policy focused, and that's. Conversations that I'm not in every day, and so I like to hear where people feel like we're going, what are these topics that people are talking about? What are people most interested in within their organization? Again, I'm trying to figure out their values, right? To connect it to really the work that we do around, we've given examples, but around traceability, right?
Many times you are gonna need some type of software, you're gonna have to put in some type of process, but then people are gonna have to do it. How are you focusing on your people through this transition? We talked about change management. Just,
[00:28:56] Francine: I literally
[00:28:58] Tia: cannot count on two hands, right? [00:29:00] We probably have had 20 conversations with software companies on, well, we got into one plant, but we can't really move forward because that plant won't use the software.
It's all change management and people readiness. We have these conversations every year around that, and we hope to help software companies help with that change management process. Because we've been there right in, in industry where they're trying to onboard this software and yeah. I'm like, we haven't prepared anyone for this, and people are pushing back and now we have it and we pay for it and no one's using it.
Even though it's great, it's great and we need it. So I like this conference because they're gonna have those conversations and really learn like, what are people talking about? What are they most interested in? How are they talking about food, safety culture? And then how can I help be a small part of that?
[00:29:45] Matt: And what would you add to Food Safety Consortium?
[00:29:49] Tia: Honestly, more culture. More culture and leadership discussions. Ah, and the true sense of culture, right, that we talked about earlier where? We don't just focus on processes [00:30:00] and documentation that aspect, but that we actually focus on, okay, how do I change behavior?
How do I really focus on the culture side of food safety?
[00:30:11] Matt: I love it. I love it. Oh, well, Tia don't eat poop.